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View Full Version : Insulation for your intake?


claymore
04-11-2010, 12:03 AM
While on another forum found this link to some good looking insulation. Wish I had this when building my airbox and it's pretty cheap to boot.

http://www.designengineering.com/category/catalog/design-engineering-inc/heat-sound-barrier/reflect-gold

https://www.designengineering.com/sites/default/files/imagecache/product_full/dei-reflectagold.jpg

VillageIdiot
04-11-2010, 10:04 AM
I am needing to insulate the intake tube to my supercharger and the boost tube from it to the throttle body.... I don't know if a radiant barrier alone would work well by itself or if it would be better to wrap some fiberglass and (or) foam around the tubing first..... Witcher is considering doing the same plus relocating the intake inlet and using a PRM filter.... Heat has twice the power drain on a boosted engine than it does on one that is naturally aspirated so the results from lowering temperatures are twice as rewarding.

manxman
04-11-2010, 12:00 PM
While on another forum found this link to some good looking insulation. Wish I had this when building my airbox and it's pretty cheap to boot.

http://www.designengineering.com/category/catalog/design-engineering-inc/heat-sound-barrier/reflect-gold

https://www.designengineering.com/sites/default/files/imagecache/product_full/dei-reflectagold.jpg
Wow! Nice. "Bling for your Boost"!

VillageIdiot
04-11-2010, 01:24 PM
That would redefine ostentatious with all of the plumbing under my hood covered with that stuff.... I guess I could have other parts gold plated and wear a gold plated Mugen shift knob around my neck on a gold plated chain or maybe as an earring to really exploit a new theme in FitFashion. The earring thing might hurt, forget that one.

manxman
04-11-2010, 02:39 PM
That would redefine ostentatious with all of the plumbing under my hood covered with that stuff.... I guess I could have other parts gold plated and wear a gold plated Mugen shift knob around my neck on a gold plated chain or maybe as an earring to really exploit a new theme in FitFashion. The earring thing might hurt, forget that one.
Then you could be "The Mr.T of Mugen" and walk around scowling and muttering "Ah pity da fool!" and other intellectual profundities like the guy on "The A Team" TV show. Yeah! Do it- do it!

VillageIdiot
04-11-2010, 05:06 PM
I had a very conservative version of his haircut at one time... Kind of an exaggerated high and tight Jarhead haircut.... I kind of like the 1/4 carat diamond that I have been wearing in my ear for the last 11 years and will stick with my weird look

claymore
04-12-2010, 01:34 AM
Have you investigated if your charge from the supercharger has a higher temperature than the underhood temps? It could well be that you need to allow the pipes to radiate to release heat rather than insulate against underhood heat which could be lower.

I measured mine using a $5 indoor/outdoor thermometer and if I remember correctly I got at the highest 150 degrees F right in the area of the plastic intake manifold cover with no vents.

VillageIdiot
04-12-2010, 05:44 AM
The charge tube goes from the S/C, mounted in front of the firewall, up toward the front and across behind the radiator tank turning back and into the throttle body.... After a drive just after dark as it was cooling off, I was seeing IAT of 160 water temp at 177 on the high end going up some pretty good hills at 85 and 90Mph getting on the boost but not WOT.... It is strange that having the heater on produces 10 to15 degree increases in the IAT and the A/C being on lowers them.... I need to mess around and do some figgerin' I reckon... Also the charge tube is pretty much in a position to absorb heat from the exhaust manifold... I have a Megan header with a heat blanket cover to install that should help....

claymore
04-12-2010, 09:30 AM
Yep sounds like you need to let it release heat or keep the engine heat off the pipes without insulating them. since ours does not have a heater do the heater hoses run near the intake system maybe hot water in the heater hoses warms them up.

On ours if you turn off the A/C is also turns off one cooling fan for the radiator maybe your turns off the cooling fan when you turn on the heater so you get higher water temps.

VillageIdiot
04-12-2010, 10:01 AM
It's pretty crazy because the water temperature isn't affected either, or at least it wasn't the first time I checked things with a scan gauge.... I am about to go out and see if I can find an affordable indoor outdoor thermometer and try moving it around under the hood and see what is going on... My IAT reads the same as he ambient temp after the car has been sitting in the shade for a few hours but if the engine is run for a minute or 2 and shut down and returned to 20 minutes later the temp is 20 or more degrees warmer. Driving at 60 MPH the IATemp is 50 degrees higher than ambient and the water temp is around 172-175... At certain speeds I have seen ignition timing readings of as high as 39 and on rare occasions 40 degrees on 93 octane fuel...

manxman
04-12-2010, 10:52 AM
Dee, try to find a thermometer that registers the minimum and maximum temperatures. Taylor Instruments is a common brand usually found at hardware and tool stores. these may be hard to find (min & max registering) because they used to be found on mercury-based thermometers. I doubt that you will find a mercury thermometer for home use anymore- just for laboratories. If you have trouble finding anything, look in your phone book for a laboratory supply company in your area.

claymore
04-12-2010, 08:41 PM
The cheapo china built indoor outdoor thermometer I got at Wally World has the highest/lowest temp memory thing.

But I have another suggestion. I think your or any other KWSC Fit are perfect candidates for water injection. Not just for the power boost you get from cooling the charge in the combustion chamber but also cooling your charge pipes before the air even gets to the TB. They can be DIY made just using the rear window washer system already on your car (unless you use it often and still want it) or locate and buy any old washer system at a junkyard and use that.

All you would need to "make" is the nozzle to control how the spray comes out. Drill a hole into the pipes where they come around the front of the engine and walla cooler charge.

You could think of using a boost related sensor to turn it on or off or just a simple switch on the throttle so it comes on at almost WOT.

VillageIdiot
04-12-2010, 09:01 PM
Thanks for the info Dave.... The problem is the intake tube entering the supercharger just inches from where the 4 exhaust tubes enter the collector.... I picked up an after market header with an insulation blanket on it but there isn't a lot that can be done other than shelling out for an inter cooler which is part of the package I want to get anyway.... I am going to have to remove the intake tube to get working room to swap headers and I will insulate what I can.... I might use some washers and longer bolts between my hood and the hinges until late October when it will cool down again.... What the hell, I've got to have something to do besides watch TV and stare at this laptop. What would I have to talk to you guys about if I just drove my car and had someone else wrench on it?

VillageIdiot
04-12-2010, 09:25 PM
The cheapo china built indoor outdoor thermometer I got at Wally World has the highest/lowest temp memory thing.

But I have another suggestion. I think your or any other KWSC Fit are perfect candidates for water injection. Not just for the power boost you get from cooling the charge in the combustion chamber but also cooling your charge pipes before the air even gets to the TB. They can be DIY made just using the rear window washer system already on your car (unless you use it often and still want it) or locate and buy any old washer system at a junkyard and use that.

All you would need to "make" is the nozzle to control how the spray comes out. Drill a hole into the pipes where they come around the front of the engine and walla cooler charge.

You could think of using a boost related sensor to turn it on or off or just a simple switch on the throttle so it comes on at almost WOT.
I am heading that way and have even picked up an AEM FI/C to be able to change the timing and air to fuel ratio to take even more advantage of the benefits Of methanol and water.... Check out "Snow" and "Devils Own" methanol and water injection.... I am going to go for the 10 lb boost upgrade even though it is pricey because this thing has worked so well other than for some power loss when the temperatures are over 85 degrees, which is most of the time around here though it has been cooler than normal for the last 4 or 5 months.... Things just take awhile to do when you're as screwed up as I am.

claymore
04-14-2010, 12:01 AM
Hey I'm always thinking of DIY stuff to do even if I don't have one of the superchargers on my Jazz. Helps keep the old mind sharp.

VillageIdiot
04-14-2010, 12:46 AM
me too, That is what I do like right now at 0230 I found a roll of exhaust wrap that I had for another project and the header I have to replace th stock one is covered with it over the insulation it came with. I picked up some aluminum tape and aluminum backed insulation.. I have some some aluminum angle and a trashed out pickup truck topper, rivets and tools to work on making a heat shield to separate the header from the supercharger..... There will be enough insulation to cover some of the pipes but one will not being used for long when I am able to upgrade.... I guess I had better try to sleep or I won't get a thing done tomorrow.

claymore
04-14-2010, 08:52 AM
Anything will help But it's inherent in superchargers to make heat as anytime you compress air it increases in temperature because there are more molecules in a smaller space so they bounce against each other causing an increase in temps.

VillageIdiot
04-14-2010, 01:24 PM
Even when I have been feather footing the go pedal and staying off of the boost, intake and boost pipes feel like they both are about the same temperature... The water temp gets up to 177 and the IAT gives a reading of 140 to 152 depending on throttle position and load.... I haven't been quite up to attacking everything today and have instead been fiddling around and thinking and googling.... I don't want to do a whole lot that will have to be redone when I start up grading but if I do and I don't have success I will know not to do it again.... I think I'll have some Mescal, maybe take a nap and jump on it tomorrow... My wife doesn't understand it when I spend to do things to my car and then change it back and have parts sitting around..... I'll have a double shot, so I will be asleep when she gets home.